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What causes herms?

What would the explanation be if you ran a ten pack of the same strain, got 8 shirleys, and one hermed?

Is it safe to say that most every strain will throw a herm plant if you run enough of them>?
I would 100% agree with this. There has to be an underlying gene in every strain that would cause this. I was just curious as I had 4 do it all at once, if it were something on my end.
 

HydroRed

3Thirteen Seeds
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
In a different thread someone hypothesized that inducing flowering on immature plants may also be a trigger for intersex issues.
Im a pretty firm believer in this too. Stress is stress, no matter if it is from a light leak or flipping to flower before it is sexually mature.
Im sure someone will eventually mention a 12/12 light schedule from seed with no intersex issues, and my reply is that I think that method is a much more "acclimated" approach of flowering before sexual maturity of the plant -vs- flipping a plant that is still maturing under one light schedule and then suddenly flipped to another all while still trying to develop sexually. Kinda like how a lot of plants can have intersexing "cloned" out. I think this just simply means you let the cut of the exact same immature plant get good and mature before its next flowering schedule and flowered under less hormonal stresses for a more satisfactory & intersex free outcome.


What would the explanation be if you ran a ten pack of the same strain, got 8 shirleys, and one hermed?

Is it safe to say that most every strain will throw a herm plant if you run enough of them>?
It may be they are all hermie proned and you just lucked out with one, or just that one particular plant is just more sensitive to stresses because it hangs heavier on the side of one of the parents that carries that trait....or possibly the one girl wasnt as sexually mature as the other 7 yet when flipped? Could be a number of things but pretty safe to say that if you run enough of anything, you will find something anomalous in comparison to all the others run whether that be balls on a girl or quality beyond compare to the others. No scientific backing, just my .02 of course.
 

Orion

CHOOSE YOUR TITLE
If it herms after veg until preflowers and alternating nodes...most likely it gots genetic issues...lot of the herm problems I see are from a short veg and most can probably be avoided by vegging till maturity....taking clones from a mature plant is usually the way to go for an early flip.
 
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Dino Party

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I try to think of all the things that "stress" my body out and then think about that in terms of plants as well. Not eating right, sleeping right, being overworked, if im in the cold/heat all day, all things that will wreak havoc on one's body and mind if unchecked. And after all, we are all just organic matter anyways. So, if you are not giving a plant the diet that it prefers to eat, if it is not able to "sleep" and have its uninterrupted periods of rest, or are just subjected to abusive conditions. These can all be stressful to living matter.

I also theorize that plants, like humans, will not always "complain" in the same way. And we see this in plants that are extra fussy, but stay stable, but at the same time we seem to have plants that "appear" healthy, but have still exhibited signs of intersex issues. I dont believe I'm saying anything that isnt common knowledge to a lot of people, I just thougth it was worth mentioning.

I'm just hoping that since I got my work hours reduced that my genitals will go back to normal.
 

Hawkman

High as a Hawk
So, last night I was moving things around a checking over plants in the flower tent. I have a Mo Swayze 21 days in that I found quite a few sacks on. She was late to sprout and had been root bound, so I blamed it on myself. Then I started to look closer at other plants and I have two Citrus Gorillas (both clones of the same mom) at day 59 that I saw nanners on, and then a Gorilla Skittlez clone and a Cherry Pie Fem seed, both 21 days in flower and both have a few sacks down low. Is my luck that bad that I could end up with 4 strains at once that hermied?!……or can something in the environment trigger them?
Environment is a 4x4 tent with close to 600w of LED. Lights on, temp and humidity are around 74-76 and 50-55%h. Lights off the temp is around 64 and humidity jumps to around 62-65%. Lights are set at 11 hours 45 minutes on. Everyone looks super happy and thriving in the tent, just baffled that 4 strains hermied at once. View attachment 97758
you do know the the hermie gene is in evey seed -- some mtimes stress brings it out - have had some very good "hermie" pot + seed to play with - just dont; grow them olut because they will polliante youor other plants in room - I ways hate to pull plants out of the mix because of a hernmie
 

DopeDaniel

Taste The Spectrum
IPM Forum Moderator
I have not seen anyone mention temperature yet. Both your daytime and nightrime temps seem low to me. I target 80F daytime and not lower than 65 at night. Bumping the nighttime temp will help with the rh.

Light leaks are where I start. Close yourself in your grow area at lights out for at least 10min to let your eyes adjust. Use black utv to seal holes.
 
I recently had the same thing happen with some CBD regs I grew. Every one of the 4 females I kept (2 each of 2 different strains) threw pollen sacs early into flower and I don't think I flipped them early. Mine were flipped on day 36 of veg (day 49 from breaking soil). Never had issues with previous grows but something in the environment had to have been the cause for all plants from 2 different strains to throw sacs at the same time...especially when the seeds weren't even feminized.
 

Dino Party

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I have not seen anyone mention temperature yet. Both your daytime and nightrime temps seem low to me. I target 80F daytime and not lower than 65 at night. Bumping the nighttime temp will help with the rh.

Light leaks are where I start. Close yourself in your grow area at lights out for at least 10min to let your eyes adjust. Use black utv to seal holes.
I did lol.

When you’re talking about those temps are you talking about LED or HID? Because both have very different sweet spots, I’ll run LED almost 10 degrees warmer than I’ll run HID. I find they create very different environments to the point you feed and water differently in each.
 
I have not seen anyone mention temperature yet. Both your daytime and nightrime temps seem low to me. I target 80F daytime and not lower than 65 at night. Bumping the nighttime temp will help with the rh.

Light leaks are where I start. Close yourself in your grow area at lights out for at least 10min to let your eyes adjust. Use black utv to seal holes.
I’m in a basement that usually stays around 63 degrees year round. The room is an 8x8 but everything is in a 4x4 tent in the room. I had light leak issues when I was using just the room for flowering, but now with the tent in there, there is absolutely no light getting to the flowering plants. I did put a space heater in the room with the tent to get the ambient temperature up a little. I have three other plants in the tent that had no herm issues at all, so I’m banking on underlying genetics. One being a Mo Swayze that looks absolutely amazing. The Mo Swayze that hermed was most likely my fault. It was left from a seedling in a little seedling container for about three months. She was probably two foot tall and spindly. I also didn’t help it by putting it in a half gallon pot for flower.

Here’s a picture of the Mo Swayze that’s getting chopped in a few days. D2141F3A-7B92-4718-9FC7-4881249013FF.jpeg 1CBA9E21-43A1-40CD-9BDC-902A7F400C9D.jpeg
 
I did lol.

When you’re talking about those temps are you talking about LED or HID? Because both have very different sweet spots, I’ll run LED almost 10 degrees warmer than I’ll run HID. I find they create very different environments to the point you feed and water differently in each.
Good to know! I am running about 600w of LED in a 4x4. So you think my temps should be up higher? For some reason I thought around 75 degrees was good, but I am always learning. Working on getting my Masters in mids right now……
 

OldG

Elite Hobbyist
Light POWER induces it too. Too much intensity of light will cause intersex...if she wants to Lola on ya.

I have it happen a lot less with a Lux meter in play (keep the tops 40 to 50k) and as was said...i do not flower until they are mature. I used to but I really didnt know what i was doing...If you want stretch do that !

:)

Keep them as comfy as possible...gentle feed...the right light power, no light leaks AND mature plants....and they can still hermy :D

F4s to F6s dont. I like when breeders do that for me.
 

DopeDaniel

Taste The Spectrum
IPM Forum Moderator
I did lol.

When you’re talking about those temps are you talking about LED or HID? Because both have very different sweet spots, I’ll run LED almost 10 degrees warmer than I’ll run HID. I find they create very different environments to the point you feed and water differently in each.
Yeah you did a good job pointing out stresses are cumulative, I think red mentioned that too. You arent just looking for the straw that broke the camels back here.

How's your testies doin?
 

Dino Party

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Yeah you did a good job pointing out stresses are cumulative, I think red mentioned that too. You arent just looking for the straw that broke the camels back here.

How's your testies doin?
Exactly, and what may be the straw for one plant, may be just another in the stack for a different plant. They’re all unique.


Man I can’t wait to call them testies again. Soon!
 

Dino Party

💩🔥 💩🔥 💩🔥
Good to know! I am running about 600w of LED in a 4x4. So you think my temps should be up higher? For some reason I thought around 75 degrees was good, but I am always learning. Working on getting my Masters in mids right now……
I was keeping my temps bout 85 with the LED, feeding a bit lighter, and had humidity bout 45% and was having great success with that til I had pH issues haha. I want to go back and find what I was reading before but it had a lot more info about this than what I’m saying right now
 

Orion

CHOOSE YOUR TITLE
Good to know! I am running about 600w of LED in a 4x4. So you think my temps should be up higher? For some reason I thought around 75 degrees was good, but I am always learning. Working on getting my Masters in mids right now……
I like to run at 80* to 85* with a lights out bottom at 70* ish...I like to adjust my humidity to pot size...bit higher with small containers...lower with 5 to 7 gal...my range is usually 45% to 60%...humidity is a big deal when dialing a room, strain, pot size, lighting, nutes and medium....when you hit the sweet spot you can't help but notice...right everything down and don't be afraid to make changes...over time in the same space you will be automatic on adjustments.
 

18B

In Bloom
I believe a lot of people get herm issues because they do not veg the plant long enough from seed...it takes 55days from seed pop for maturity...1 reason....genetics today have been bred poorly to get them out quicker then the next and has led to this...2 reason.
 

Orion

CHOOSE YOUR TITLE
Grower errors....reason 3...don't know what happened with 3???
Yes...operator error is a common thing with new growers that tend to force and rush the whole process before they learn the patience it takes to let the plant live it's full life cycle given it's conditions the grower supplies. Proper veg...only the nutes the plant needs and uses given it's eviroment supplied...and a complete life cycle wether it is 52 days or 125 days
The KISS method has always worked for me and the results of keeping it simple and fine tuning with SMALL adjustments works best always.
 
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